Interview with Virginia Davis

Title: Interview with Virginia Davis Identifier: 1979oh073 Date: 1979-01-17 Interviewer: William Berge Project: Kentucky Newspaper Editors Project

The following is an unrehearsed taped interview with Virginia Davis, editor of The McCreary County Record, by William Berge, of the Oral History Center at Eastern Kentucky University. The interview is conducted at Ms. Davis's office on January 17, 1979, at 9 a.m.

Berge: Ms. Davis, I want to thank you for allowing me to come down here this morning and talk with you. Before we get talking about your paper and such, I'd like to learn a little bit about you, uh...where you were born, and where you went to school, and when you were born, if you don't mind, that sort of thing.

Davis: I was born in Warren County in...

Berge: Kentucky?

Davis: ...in Smiths Grove.

Berge: Smiths Grove?

Davis: Um-hum.

Berge: My best friend was born at Smiths Grove. Jack Cook.

Davis: Who was that?

Berge: Jack Cooke.

Davis: Let's see. Jack Cooke.

Berge: He's about...uh...I guess late forties now. That's strange. All right, 1:00so you were born in Smiths Grove.

Davis: Yeah. Well, I know there were a lot of Cookes around there.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: Wonder who his daddy was?

Berge: He was...he was a druggist.

Davis: Yeah. I know who you're talking about.

Berge: I don't remember his name, but he was a druggist.

Davis: Yeah. John White Cooke.

Berge: John White. That was...that's Jack's name. John White Cook.

Davis: Yeah. Well, that's his father.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Yeah. Probably knew him when he was a little boy.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: About five or so.

Berge: Yeah. Yeah. Uh... So you were born in Smiths Grove. When?

Davis: When?

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Hmmm. 1919.

Berge: 1919.

Davis: I'm a pioneer. [Laughing]

Berge: Did you go to school in Smiths Grove?

Davis: Yes. Finished high school there and went to...uh...Western...Western Kentucky University it is now.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: Graduated there.

Berge: Oh, you graduated Western. When'd you graduate?

Davis: 1943.

Berge: What'd you take?

Davis: Uh...I majored in English and took all the journalism they had. And just 2:00about all the history they had. And minored in art.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: Really minored in history. And, I was on the staff of the College Heights Herald. Went down to the Bowling Green paper just a few days before I was to graduate and asked them how to go about getting a job on a newspaper. Everybody else was out looking up jobs and it suddenly occurred to me I was about to graduate and still didn't have a job in sight.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Uh... Mr. Clarence Gaines, the publisher, uh...talked to me a few minutes. Said he didn't have any openings, but he gave me a copy of the trade journal. And, I ran an ad in that. And, uh...I answered an ad and got the job...

Berge: Where?

Davis: ...the...uh...ad I answered over at Kingsport, Tennessee.

Berge: Kingsport. Well, let me just stop. Let's go back a minute. What were your parents' names?

Davis: Uh... Same as mine. Virginia Wood Cox Davis and Elmore Wood Davis.

Berge: Uh-huh. Who...who was the...uh...what was the Cox?

Davis: He was a depot agent.

Berge: What's the Cox from? Is that your mother's maiden name.

Davis: Yes. Uh-huh.

Berge: Was she any kin to Meredith?

Davis: Uh...uh...sister.

Berge: Really?

Davis: Uh-huh.

Berge: That's incredible. Huh. Well, anyway. Then, uh, Virginia, you...uh...went to Smiths Grove High school. Were... Did you have any particular teachers in the public schools who...who impressed you one way or another? Can you...

Davis: Oh, yes. Very much. Uh...

Berge: Who?

Davis: I would never have thought about going into journalism I guess if it hadn't been for my English teach in high school. Uh...she was the one that suggested it to my mother...uh...on the basis of my theme writing.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: That was Virginia Cox Proffitt, she is now.

Berge: Was she kin to you, then, I guess?

Davis: No. No.

Berge: No.

Davis: No. No. Not Cox. That's not right. Virginia Ferguson...uh...Proffitt.

Berge: OK.

Davis: She was Virginia...

Berge: Ferguson.

Davis: ...Ferguson Stone then.

Berge: Uh-huh. So you went to Bowling Green...at...how...at Bowling Green at Western were there any teachers there that you remember fondly? Or...[unclear]

Davis: Oh, yes, a great many. I started to go to the University of Kentucky but...uh...uh...something happened I ended up going to Western, and I was always very well pleased with the choice.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: I've always had...uh...Western real close to my heart.

Berge: Um-hum.

Davis: Uh... Miss Frances Richards, of course, was just a legend in journalism there. And, she and I were real good friends. And, uh...oh, many people on the staff. Dr. A.M. Stickles and Dr. Gordon Wilson, head of the English department. 5:00Of course Dr. Stickles head of the history department. And...uh...Miss Gabrielle Robertson in the history department. Ivan Wilson the head of the art department. Mary Ruth Lemons. Oh, I just can't tell you [laughing] so many. Dero Downing's wife sat right across from me in one class. Harriet...oh...right now I can't think what her last name is.

Berge: Uh-hum.

Davis: Starts with S from Searcy, Arkansas, I remember. She's a very fine person.

Berge: Uh...uh... What do you want me to call you? Virginia or Ms. Davis?

Davis: Virginia...will be fine.

Berge: All right. Uh... Virginia, when you went to Kingsport, what was the name of the paper over there?

Davis: The Times-News.

Berge: Kingsport Times... Was it a daily? Or a weekly?

Davis: Yes.

Berge: A daily. How long did you stay there?

Davis: Umm... Nine and a half years.

Berge: Hmm. What'd you do?

Davis: Well, as I told you before, I answered this ad as a society editor, but something came up, uh...oh yes, they had such a fine paper when they sent it to me I wrote them a letter and told them I had absolutely no experience in lay out, no experience in head writing, and it would save me a lot of problems and them a lot of problems if I just didn't take that job. Uh...well at that particular time...uh...there were all...all the men were in the war...and I was just getting telegrams right and left to come anywhere in the United States for a job. [Laughing] So I got this letter back from them, and it had been lost six weeks in their own...uh...uh...mailroom somewhere, dropped down somewhere. 7:00Anyway, the letter was dated six weeks from the date of the postmark. Well, the...the time they found the letter and mailed it to me I'd already taken my first...uh...daily newspaper job, which is on The Henderson Gleaner and Journal.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: As a general assignment reporter. So, it ended up that I didn't get to Kingsport until about 1946.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And I stayed there 'till late 1955.

Berge: What did you do down in Kingsport? What...what kind of jobs did you have at the paper?

Davis: I was state news editor. I covered southwest Virginia and east Tennessee.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: All the time I was there.

Berge: Was that a good experience?

Davis: Oh, wonderful.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: One of the best newspapers and most pleasant...uh...jobs I think I ever had.

Berge: Um-hum. Where'd you go from there?

Davis: Well, I decided that I had just become saturated with that experience, 8:00and I wanted to go see how they pickup pecans and live in the deeper south and have a more southern experience. And, I went down to Aiken, South Carolina, to work for The Augusta Herald. And, I didn't stay very long there, just enough there to have an interesting experience. And, went on to the Savannah Evening Press.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, stayed there...had a real interesting experience there. But, at that time Martin Luther King was attracting all the...uh...big time papers...

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Harrison Salisbury from The New York Times and just everybody was flocking down there to the bus boycotts.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, so I applied for a job just to be on scene.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, uh...I applied for a job on the Alabama Journal and got called at 9:00midnight one night by the managing editor on the Montgomery Advertiser. And, I took a job there as assistant state editor. And, uh...just about the time I got there they had another one of the big...uh...uh...bus shootings. And, I did a sidebar on the passengers who were on the bus.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And their experiences. And, and...uh...oh, I traveled all over the central and south Alabama from Dothan to Demopolis.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, I...stayed down there for about a year I think. And...

Berge: That was a pretty good experience, I guess.

Davis: Yeah, it was. In fact, every experience I've had's been a good experience. [Laughing] I...I wanted to go on to Florida, though. Uh... The Miami 10:00Herald was my dream newspaper, and I wanted to get down there. But, I never could get a job on the Herald. So, I got a job on Hollywood Sun-Tattler...

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: ...which was a three-day weekly at that time. So I went on down there, and...uh...

Berge: Got some sun.

Davis: Yeah.

Berge: [Laughing]

Davis: Worked about a year on that and then came up to Rock Hill, South Carolina, worked two years on that paper.

Berge: What'd you do there?

Davis: General assignment.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: And...uh...from there...I...I got tired of working about fifty-two hours a week. And I got a letter from a friend who's talking about what a wonderful job this mutual friend of ours...uh...had...uh...on the Tallahassee Democrat. Both of us was ex-Kingsporters.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: All three of us rather. And, so I wrote Dot Brown back and I said next 11:00time you write Dot Rain...Dot Ring, ask her if there are any more of those fabulous forty-hour a week jobs on the Tallahassee Democrat, and if there are, uh...put my name in the pot. Sometime later, uh...Malcolm Johnson, the editor of the Tallahassee Democrat...uh...wrote me a letter and said Dot Ring had told him all about me and he'd been thinking a lot about...uh...where I could fit in but there just were no openings down there. But, if I was interested... if I were interested in a job in Florida to write to...uh...Bennett DeLoach on he Tampa Times. So I wrote the managing editor of the Tamp Times and I ended up down there. 1960. And, stayed there until 1969. Then, I...

Berge: So...so really I guess then, Kingsport and the Tampa paper were your longest stints.

Davis: Right. Yeah.

Berge: What'd you down there?

Davis: Uh...well, I did just about everything. I was a combination city reporter and suburban area reporter. Covered the East Hillsborough, North Hillsborough, and, then, finally, South Hillsborough. And just about anything. Spot news. Features.

Berge: Was it a forty-hour week?

Davis: Oh, yes. Hm-hum.

Berge: So, you did cut down on your...

Davis: And incidentally, after I moved to the Tampa Times, the...uh...Rock Hill paper went on a forty-hour week. [Both laughing]

Davis: About a year later. [Laughing] But I enjoyed that. I had an interesting experience at Rock Hill.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: There was a large group of Catawba Indians there and...oh...way back in 13:00history they had been wards of the state. Um...York, Lancaster and...uh...Chester counties. And every year they'd go to the legislature and say give me this, you know?

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, so the...uh...state of South Carolina bought them a reservation and...uh...it was right outside of Rock Hill, you know, and...uh...there had been a Congressional legislative committee that had hearings down there on the plight of the Catawba Indians some fifteen or twenty years before and the people in York County had testified that everybody knows that Indians can't learn anything so there's no use to spend money educating them. So...[laughing]...uh...they had another one of those legislative hearing while I was there. And, they had a man from the Bureau of Indian Affairs down to make a 14:00study of them, you know. So, I went to his first...uh...uh...session with the local people. And, there was a Charlotte Observer reporter there. He was just...oh...like he was just taking over. He just knew all about them. And, just gave me that...uh...put down sort of feeling, you know. Of course, I was new and I didn't know a Catawba Indian from a Hindu. And...uh...this program officer and I were among the last to leave, and we were coming down the steps in this hotel where the...uh...meeting took place. And, right now I can't think of his name...and came down the steps and I said, well, Mr. Bitney...that was it...I said Mr. Bitney, what in the world does a program officer do? And, well, he thought that was the funniest question. And he just roared. It just kind of 15:00established a rapport between us. And we ended up...uh...I told him...that...over the long period that he was going to be there that we had a good filing system and if he ever felt like he wanted any background material to just come down to the Herald I'd help him out anyway I could. Or, since he was a stranger in town, if he ever wanted to come around and just sit and chitchat...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...or get anything out of his system...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...he could talk to me...uh...confidentially or on the record either one, you know. So we just established a wonderful rapport. So, it ended up I got the first break on his report, you know. And, he...uh... his...uh...recommendation was to make the Indians first class citizens...uh...divide up the reservation and give each one his share, you know. And, and, uh...everything like that. 16:00Well, part of his report...uh...stated that ...uh...there wasn't about four full-blooded Catawba Indians in all of South Carolina, I think, and...uh...therefore most of them had so much white blood that...uh...it just didn't really make sense to treat 'em as Indians. Well, uh...I wrote my story the next day and handed it in to the managing editor and he said, well, said I think we'd better get our lawyer to come down and read your story. So, they did. And...uh...company lawyer sat there and he chuckled over the story and he says, well, says what you've done here is call about 250...uh...Indians in York County bastards, you know. And, I said, oh...it's that bad is it. And, uh... [Both laughing]

Davis: He said, I'm afraid it is. And he said...I said, well, just shuck it up 17:00and put it in the waste basket. And, he said, no, said...uh...it's an interesting story and it should be told. He says, but, what I can't figure out is I'm a lawyer and I didn't even know about this law you're citing in here.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And it was the state miscegenation law that he had never read, which said that it was against the law for whites to intermarry with Mestizo, Chinese, Mexicans...uh...uh...Indians or whatever, you know.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: So at that time, which was 1958 or '59...uh...oh, it was...you just...uh...treaded very carefully about whites and people of color.

Berge: Sure.

Davis: You know, marrying. So, it ended...ended up that...uh...uh...the Catawba Indian comm....uh...uh... delegation...they had a committee saying that 18:00legislative...uh...group that ...uh...was in charge of the affairs of Indians...the Catawbas, and...uh...uh...it ended up that they recommended this change in the legislation. Well, the Indians were all mad at me before this, you know. And, oh, they...when I went to the office the next morning after this story was page one...uh...top play, you know...uh...one woman was on the phone crying. What did I mean by slinging mud, you know?

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: I said, well look lady, I'm not really slinging mud. I said, uh...I don't have any feeling against Indians. I'm trying to help you. And, uh...I said I understand how you feel and...uh...you can help me by telling your 19:00people...uh...what we need to do here. If there's a little cloud on your...uh...legal rights, we need to get that corrected. Well, I called up the secretary of the tribal council, Albert Sanders, and, I said look, if I've got your people all so upset, uh...when you have a meeting, I'll meet with you. And, uh...I'll be your secretary. I'll draft letters. Do anything. We'll just take this thing, and we'll just get this settled if you want to. He said, well, I appreciate it. I went out to that tribal council, I thought I'd get scalped. But, it was a just a long session of overcoming and with Albert the chief of the tribal council's help, plus the secretary, who was one of my very dear friends, we got everything fixed up. The law was...well, a special law was put in. It 20:00sneaked through the legislature that recognized all marriages between whites and Catawba Indians.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, then...uh...in 1960...

Berge: When was this? '59?

Davis: Yeah, about. In about 1960 or '61, I think, the state of Virginia had a case before the U.S. Supreme Court that outlawed all miscegenation laws in the south, so I had proceeded about two years what eventually took place nationally.

Berge: [Laughing] That was interesting, wasn't it? That really is interesting...uh...episode. Tell me, what did you do after you left Tampa?

Davis: Well, I got a better job. And, I became the first woman deskman on Florida Times-Union at Jacksonville.

Berge: The deskperson.

Davis: That's right.

Berge: [Laughing] At Jacksonville.

Davis: Yeah. I was down there writing headlines for the front page. Of course, not alone, I was on the rim with about five other people. Uh...when the man landed on the moon and Charles Manson was...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...uh...arrested and charged with the big California mass slayings. Oh, Queen Elizabeth did something I remembered. I had one headline I kind of was proud of.

Berge: What was that?

Davis: Oh, I don't remember now.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: But, I remember it was commented on at the time. And...uh...then one day the managing editor asked me if I'd like to get back into news again. And, I said, well, it was...kind of an interesting break. It didn't really make any difference. And, he said, well I've got a opening in the bureau at Brunswick, 22:00Georgia, and I've...will have to hire either a deskman or a bureau chief for that job, and I just thought maybe if you'd like to get back in the news it might be an opportunity for you. So, I went up there and looked it over and came back and reported to him I thought I'd like to go there. And, uh...so...I went up there. Jimmy Carter was running for....

Berge: Governor. [Laughing]

Davis: ...governor of Georgia. And, I met Jimmy and Rosalynn. Of course, Jimmy was there several times...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...and I was in press conferences with him. A lot of interesting things happened there, too.

Berge: What'd you think of him?

Davis: Well, amazingly, I...I thought he had such a very sharp mind. I thought of him then as presidential caliber. And, I thought someday...

Berge: You never really did think he could pull it off though, did you? I mean...

Davis: I certainly did. I thought...

Berge: That's interesting.

Davis: ...at the time someday you'll be president of the United States.

Berge: Well, that's something. I...uh...I saw him one or two times on television in Georgia when I was at my brother-in-law's. And, uh... I immediately liked him, but I really...the reason I liked him was my brother-in- law didn't, and that's good enough for me, I... [laughing] whatever he says I know is wrong. So, when my brother-in-law didn't like him I knew he must be all right. But, I was...I saw him two or three times, but, I...of course, I never thought about him that way when I first saw him. Uh... Well, how long did you stay there, then?

Davis: Oh...uh...I was with the Times-Union I think about a year and a half or something like that.

Berge: Then what did you do? Come up here?

Davis: Uh...no...I had spent so much time around Tampa that...uh...I wanted to get back in that area.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: So, I got a job on The St. Petersburg Times in Dade City, Florida, I was there...I was a two-county reporter.

Berge: Hm-hum. Dade City, that's Orange County, I guess, isn't it.

Davis: That's right. East Pasco.

Berge: Hm-hum. Lot of Kentuckians teach in that school system.

Davis: That's true. Yes.

Berge: Dade City.

Davis: We have several subscribers right here. Living right in Dade City, Zephyrhills...

Berge: Yeah. Huh?

Davis: New Port Richey.

Berge: Yeah. Friend of mine was down there one time, this was years ago. Well, tell me. When'd you come here?

Davis: Uh...I came here in August of 1977. So, I'm really a newcomer.

Berge: Did you come from Dade City?

Davis: Uh-huh.

Berge: Uh... What would you call...would you call this newspaper, this type newspaper you're in here, would you call this a community newspaper?

Davis: Oh, definitely.

Berge: Uh-huh. Uh...Let me just ask you some questions about this one specifically, and then I'm going to ask you some general questions. Why do you publish on Tuesday? Most of them do on Thursday.

Davis: I know it. [Laughing] I...that's a...

Berge: Is that just historical...or?

Davis: Apparently so. I don't know why they ever...uh...selected Tuesday. But a few years ago they changed over to Thursday. And, the people...you know, McCreary countians can't stand change.

Berge: [Laughing] If God had wanted it to be on Thursday he'd have had it on Thursday from the beginning.

Davis: That's right. Exactly. So there was so much...uh...uh...feedback that they changed it back to Tuesday. Uh...I think Thursday would be a much better day for various reasons. Everybody gets paid on Thursday or Friday or Saturday. And, uh... Grocery ads come out on Wednesdays as a rule in most papers or on Thursday.

Berge: Do you think you lose advertising because of this?

Davis: Hmmm.

Berge: Do you think there might be any, say Somerset stores which would advertise here if...uh...you had a Thursday...a Thursday day?

Davis: I don't know whether they would or not. We've got...uh...quite a number of food markets in this area.

Berge: Uh-uh. I was thinking department stores or something like that maybe.

Davis: Hm-hum. I don't know whether it'd have any effect on it or not, but I know the affect would be that it would...uh...keep me alive longer because I have to work six days a week and ...uh...it really puts a strain on me.

Berge: You'd be on a five day week if you had a Thursday publication, wouldn't you?

Davis: I could be off on Saturdays and Sundays.

Berge: Sure. Sure. It really is strange. Uh, is there any other papers doing Tuesday? In the state?

Davis: Not to my knowledge.

Berge: I don't know of one.

Davis: This is probably the only one in the United States of 27:00America...and...all around the world.

Berge: I was really surprised when I got to talk with you today because, you know, generally Tuesdays and Wednesdays are the really busy days.

Davis: Um-hum.

Berge: On these papers. And, of course, this is your...

Davis: Tuesday's our day.

Berge: Oh, yeah.

Davis: Monday's our real busy day. We go to Somerset and do all our final work up there because the paper's published up there.

Berge: It's printed there, too.

Davis: Put to bed there, right. And, uh... It's delivered down here about...uh...noon on Tuesdays. And...

Berge: Who owns this paper?

Davis: The Commonwealth Journal in Somerset.

Berge: Oh...Somerset. Is it... Do they own any others?

Davis: The Commonwealth Journal.

Berge: Just that, I mean.

Davis: Uh-huh.

Berge: So you really wouldn't say it's a change, then...

Davis: No. Uh-huh.

Berge: They just happen...they just happen to own this paper. Um...this might be...

Davis: McCreary County is very fortunate that they do own it.

Berge: Why?

Davis: Well, they're just a fine, two newspaper family.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: That...They're very community minded.

Berge: It's an incredibly good looking paper...

Davis: It is.

Berge: ...that you've got. It's really is one of the fine looking papers in the state.

Davis: It's not...uh...dedicated to making a profit like chain newspapers are.

Berge: Yeah. That's what...that's what I was going to ask you. What would be the advantages and disadvantages of both chain and say locally owned papers like this?

Davis: Well...

Berge: In your opinion.

Davis: A chain newspaper is...uh...really...it...it...before it ever comes in...uh...it's got to look at your profit and loss sheet, see? Uh... Now in this particular instance, uh...you can look up there, volume...uh...60...number

Berge: Volume 60, number 17.

Davis: That means this paper's sixty years old.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Well, it started...it means it started out sixty years ago. It's been in continuous publication. Uh... It's had, I guess maybe, one, two, three, four, 29:00five...maybe six editors in its whole years.

Berge: Now, that's incredible, isn't it?

Davis: Uh... Professor Hume, who's a legend here, was a school principal and a teacher. And...

Berge: What's his name?

Davis: Professor Clarence...uh...Hume.

Berge: H-U-M-E.

Davis: Yeah. Right. He died in 19...uh...78.

Berge: Oh. That's who you replaced then?

Davis: Yes. Well, not really, exactly. He...uh...held the job I think about thirty years and retired. And, then he was succeeded by Patrick Thomas, who was a local boy. And...uh...then there was Jeff Kerr. And, then me. See?

Berge: But, really except for those...

Davis: Pat and...

Berge: ...two short...

Davis: Jeff...

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: ...kept it rather short periods.

Berge: What do they do now?

Davis: Well, I don't really know. I understand Pat Thomas is in the Nashville 30:00area. His father lives over here at Stearns.

Berge: Is he in newspaper still...in newspaper business?

Davis: I'm not sure whether he is or not. He used to be on the magazine Hustler, I understand.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And he may be on The Nashville Tennessean. I'm just not sure.

Berge: Huh.

Davis: Jeff Kerr is on another newspaper in community journalism. I think on the Carlisle, Kentucky, newspaper. He's a fine young man. Did a good job and...uh...so did Pat. Pat did our justice special in October 1975, which is just...just almost a period piece...

Berge: Yeah, I know.

Davis: ...for this...uh...newspaper.

Berge: Tell me this, uh... how'd you find out about the job here? [Tape stopped and restarted. Voices muffled]

Davis: Uh, yes, uh...to bring up a little more in the sequence...uh...from The 31:00St. Petersburg Times I was uh...enticed to become the...uh...chief reporter and managing editor if I wanted it of the little Dade City paper. This was a paper that was organized by a group of Dade City businessmen who knew absolutely nothing about operating the newspaper. But, uh...one of the enterprising ones...uh...was the publisher and...uh...enticed me to join the paper. So I turned down the job as managing editor because I...it had too much responsibility to it and I told them you need a reporter worse than you need a managing editor. So...uh...I started in there in 1973. Well, what they had in 32:00mind was...uh...to get a community college established there and then sell the newspaper. So, when I went in they were already trying to market the newspaper and they wanted to make it look good so they hired me. And, then they sold the newspaper to the Dix news chain of Ohio. And...uh...one of...one of them operates The Frankfort State...uh...Journal. Albert Dix, you know?

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: And, his brother was my boss down at Dade City. Well, they eventually sold that newspaper and...uh... I think the...the buyers were probably interested in reselling it, kind of a broker type operation, you know. So, when they got down there and they saw how things really were, their...uh... 33:00profit...uh...and loss...uh...operating system was just a budget cutting one. So in one fell swoop they just swept the production manager, the chief pressman...

Berge: And the reporter.

Davis: And the reporter and all of us out. [Both laughing] Four of us. And just got all old minimum wage help, you know.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Then they sold out. And it's been, I think, resold about twice since.

Berge: Uh-huh. Well, how'd you hear about this?

Davis: So, uh...there I was out of a job. And, I said, well, I've been working for thirty-five years and I haven't been out of a job yet. So, if the good Lord wants me to work on newspapers again I'm just going to let him find me a job. So, I just forgot about it. So, I hadn't been up in Kentucky for fourteen years. So, I decided I'd come back, and go back to my old haunts, and look up some old 34:00friends and relatives before they were all dead. And...uh...so, I was just passing through from Warren and Barren county...uh...over to I-75, and was on my way to Kingsport, Tennessee. And, I was riding along and I was thinking about a letter I'd gotten from an old friend of mine on the Tampa Times. You know, newspaper people hardly ever have time...the energy left to write letters. So, I hadn't heard from Darlene since abut 1972. And, she'd written me that she'd gotten married to a fellow who was writing sports on a Somerset newspaper. And, I didn't even know Somerset had a newspaper. So, I thought if I don't look her up now I will forget where she ever went, you know. And, I couldn't even remember what his name was. So, looked up the newspaper there and walked in and 35:00I said, I'd like to find out where Darlene Carter...uh...is located and I understand her husband either works or did work as a sport writer or editor on this newspaper. So, they were very helpful. Yes, they knew her. She was working on the Lexington paper and...uh...he was in public relations in Lexington. So...uh...they were just very helpful in finding how to contact them and everything. So, I said, well, I'm at liberty now. You got any good jobs open here in the editorial department? And, I was talking to Ken Shmidheiser, and he said, well, we don't have anything here, but we certainly do need a managing editor on our McCreary County Record. Well, I'd never been in McCreary County before in my life and I didn't know if it was north, east, south, or west.

Berge: You found out it was northern Tennessee, didn't you. [Laughing]

Davis: So...uh... He said I wish you had time to talk to our managing editor, George Joplin, who had gone to the Rotary Club meeting at that time. Well, I said, it is lunch time. I'll go out and find something to eat and I'll be back. So, I talked to Mr. Joplin. And...uh... Went straight on over to London, got onto I-75 not even knowing if McCreary County was down here and even worth looking at, you know. I mean, we just talked about the possibility of a job. But, there was, you know, not anything really firmed up or anything like that. So, I went on over on I-75 to Kingsport and on down back to Tampa. One day I got a call from him and...uh...uh...I ended up here.

Berge: What do you think of it now? How long have you been here? Two years.

Davis: Right.

Berge: What do you think...well a year and a half, I guess, isn't it?

Davis: Yeah.

Berge: What do you think of it?

Davis: Well, it's been really an interesting...uh...experience. Uh...I feel like I've learned a lot. And...uh...I feel proud of what we've been able to accomplish here. I think we've accomplished nothing but good for the paper and the community.

Berge: Let me just get back to the original question I asked you about fifteen or twenty minutes ago. Do you know any other ad...what are some additional disadvantages you can think of if your...this paper was a chain paper instead of what it is. What would it mean to you?

Davis: Mean to me? Well...well...

Berge: Do you think you'd have as much freedom as an editor for a chain?

Davis: One of the things I experienced with the chain newspapers 38:00is...it's...uh...a less personal touch. Uh...all of our staff here has a feeling of...we're just part of one big family.

Berge: Uh-huh. Uh-huh.

Davis: Uh... We don't have any little...uh...psychological hang ups. We go up there and they talk to us like ...uh...they're interested in us and what we're doing and if we got an idea...uh...they believe in us. There's just a kind of a more secure...uh...feeling then there is on a chain. On a chain you never know what's going on. They may sell out tomorrow just like...uh...my experience down at Dade City.

Berge: Account...Accountants really run chain papers, don't they?

Davis: That's correct.

Berge: Newspaper people don't run 'em.

Davis: That's right.

Berge: Tell me...uh...your ideas about the differences and distinctions between working on a...a community weekly like this and the dailies you've worked on. How would you compare the experiences?

Davis: Uh... I don't notice that there's any difference whatsoever. When I...uh...thought about...uh... joining the Dade City paper, here I was working for a big metropolitan newspaper, one of the best. In fact, it's front page slogan was "Florida's Best Newspaper." And, in a lot of ways I believed that. They really accomplished wonders in Florida. Uh... It's just one of the best organized and managed newspapers there is in the country. And, I'm real proud of the experience I had there as well as on the Tampa Times and The Florida Times- 40:00Union. Uh... Well, I think that I've just worked for some of the best and some of the worst newspapers in the county. So, I'm a pretty fair judge of them. Uh... But, when I went to Dade City, was thinking about going, I thought, well, I'm getting up in years...uh...the speed and deadline pressure that you're under...

Berge: On a daily.

Davis: ...on a daily...Uh...I...I'm not going to be able to keep that up. It's not worth it. It's a rat race.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: And, uh... It's a young man's game. And, I don't have to be bothered with that. But, with what I know, the all-around experience that I've had. Uh... This is a little offset paper. If I learn how they operate, I'll never be without a job as long as I want to work on a newspaper.

Berge: Hm-hum

Davis: And I feel that. I might be without a job three months, six months, or whatever. Uh... But, now I feel like as long as I want to work and am able to work...uh...that somewhere there will be a job for me.

Berge: I've got the feeling, just talking to people, because I don't...didn't know anything about the newspaper business until this last four or five months. I have a feeling from talking to some people that there's been a bunch of money made by people on these weeklies. People who buy and sell them and this sort of stuff.

Davis: I think so, too.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: Uh... I think, uh...

Berge: I mean...

Davis: There's a new...

Berge: The paper value of them has gone sky high in recent years. You know?

Davis: There's a new attitude about...uh...newspapers when I came back, that I was really shocked at, and...and something that hurts me. Uh... The Knoxville News Sentinel, when I worked on The Kingsport Times, that was kind of our idol.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Just a crack newspaper. Uh...today it's a little paper.

Berge: That's right.

Davis: Uh...they went everywhere and did everything.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: Now...uh...they hardly ever go anywhere.

Berge: Everything comes in services.

Davis: It's not regional like it was.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Louisville Courier-Journal, you read stories they've got to make twelve percent profit this year and this that and the other. And, they're cutting down their staff. And, they're not as regional.

Berge: I've gotten the feeling that...

Davis: And...when I...

Berge: I use to love the Courier, and I'd just soon not have it sometimes...as far...

Davis: When... When I...

Berge: ...as what they do for us.

Davis: When I grew up in Kentucky, everybody that could read in the state of Kentucky took the Courier-Journal and there wasn't any little daily newspapers in the state of Kentucky except at Paducah and Bowling Green...and...

Berge: Lexington.

Davis: ...Hopkinsville and...

Berge: Northern Kentucky.

Davis: ...Ashland and...Lexington. And, I don't think there...

Berge: And Covington, I think.

Davis: Yeah, but they didn't just seem to amount to anything.

Berge: That's right.

Davis: They were just little community newspapers then. But, the Courier was THE leader. It was the lea...it was THE newspaper you read to find out all the bad things that was going on in Frankfort. And, I think they're still...uh, along with the Lexington paper particularly, are the leaders when it comes to doing the...the...the real job that people need to kn...uh...know about in the capital.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: And I...and I hate to see them...uh...retract their gears, so to speak.

Berge: But, they are.

Davis: But, they are.

Berge: They're pulling in.

Davis: Now, this means that all these other little papers and like... Why I use to go from Kingsport back to Warren and Barren counties...uh...on a weekend trip and I drive through Somerset. Well, I couldn't even remember Somerset being more 44:00than a place that slowed you down going around a little square, see.

Berge: Um-hum. Yeah.

Davis: I didn't even know they even had a newspaper in Somerset until I stopped there a year and a half ago. Uh...this means that all these little papers are going to somehow have to keep a tighter watch on their legislators. Their governor. Their state cabinet officers.

Berge: Their representatives.

Davis: And, we just can't do that.

Berge: Their representatives.

Davis: Right.

Berge: Yeah. Let me just ask something I was going to ask you, then. What do you think the responsibility and function of these county newspapers are? You know, I get two or three different kinds of answers. Some people seem to think, I get from talking to them, that they shouldn't do anything except to be...uh... public service reps...things. You know, in other words, what's good for the 45:00community is what we'll print, you know. Or, sort of like Chamber of Commerce organs. You know, that's what... And, then I... occasionally I get, I'll hear an occasional editor say no, they think they have a responsibility to... Now, sort of like I read in your...uh...an editorial this morning when I bought your paper about, where you were talking about...uh...there're certain kinds of things that if you knew about them...uh...you felt...you would feel a responsibility to print it...

Davis: Well, my philosophy...

Berge: ...as an editor.

Davis: ... being in journalism has been if Go lets it happen, let's print it.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Yeah, I just have...uhhh...a sharp feeling for truth. I feel that the newspaper is the mirror of the community. Uh... And...it...it...it almost has to tell people what they look like. What they're doing. And, they can interpret for 46:00themselves...uh...what they need to do about themselves. Now, I don't have this feeling that we have to...uh...you know, always project our good side and bury our bad side, because you...if we do, we're just really not facing up to our responsibilities and to the responsibilities that the public has to itself.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: It's so...last...uh...a year ago, in the general election [cough], excuse me, in this county there were as in a number of Eastern Kentucky counties just a real problem with the absentee ballots. Uh...I think there's about 750 applications for absentee ballots out of about 14,000 population. Everybody was going...

Berge: Going to be sick.

Davis: ...to be gone...

Berge: Be sick or gone that day.

Davis: ...on election day. So...uh...it just commenced to have a pattern to it. It... If you went over to the county court clerk's office...uh...you can establish this pattern. What's happened. So all I did was just write what was happening there. And...of course...it...uh...looked like that legislation was needed to...uh...uh...tighten up the absentee ballot law. Well, I was real proud of what we did on that. We were, if not the first, one of the first to bring that up as a problem. And, the General Assembly responded positively with new legislation that they say is really working miracles.

Berge: Have you been editor...

Davis: So, this helps the people.

Berge: Have you been editor here in any school board elections yet?

Davis: Oh. Oh, yes.

Berge: That's something here.

Davis: That's what I was told. But, the funny part of it was that this year it was as quiet as I don't know.

Berge: That's what I understand.

Davis: People say, really, the Record told everything that's been going on. There wasn't anything to create any big issues.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, it was...everything...that was....uh...

Berge: Seemed to be going on.

Davis: Scandal was kind of explained away. So, it was very quiet.

Berge: Well, that...that's interesting.

Davis: And, I think...that uh...

Berge: Probably because you were doing your job.

Davis: I think...I think that's right. I think that people understand what's going on. And, I think this has been a problem in McCreary County that...uh...[unclear].

Berge: They've been dealing more in personalities than in issues, too, over the years.

Davis: Oh, yes. I think so, too. And, then, issues have never been...uh...explained...and news was something that...uh...was transmitted by 49:00telephone or on the street corner. Sometimes it was true and sometimes not true. As one public official told me...before I was elected...uh...I was under the impression that everything was...uh...wrong, that people were stealing the money and this, that, and the other. Now, that I'm in office, I understand the problems. Uh... That people are doing a better job than I thought they were doing.

Berge: You know, it's too bad that sometimes public officials don't sue other public officials for slander when they're...as a result of...uh...elections, isn't it?

Davis: Well, uh...I don't think you can do it. [Laughing]

Berge: No. No, but I said it's too bad they can't. I think it's an awful...I think it's an awful pattern where your just calling your opponent a criminal, a crook, you know, that sort of thing without having to substantiate it.

Davis: Well... Uh... I... One thing that I have noticed in Kentucky 50:00is...uh...uh...it reminds me so much of the politics that I, uh, remembered when the politicians used to come around and [unclear] courtyard, and everybody gathered around, and it was just like a circus show.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: It was just fun for a child to watch all this rhetoric.

Berge: When I lived in Arkansas, they did it in old churches.

Davis: You'd... You'd think why in the world doesn't he beat him up with something.

Berge: [Laughing] Yeah.

Davis: Well, I find that there's still a lot of that. Well, ...

Berge: There is.

Davis: ...you don't find this where I've been. And, I think, well, this state hasn't grown up in forty years. And, this is kind of an impression...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...I get about Kentucky. Is...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...the state is backwoodsie.

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: And, if McCreary County's backwoodsie, it...it's because the state of Kentucky's not really doing its job.

Berge: Sure.

Davis: For instance... [Loud noise in background]

Berge: Is that a train?

Davis: For instance, it's just now coming up among some of the fiscal court members, uh...that some of the issues raised about the local ambulance service personnel...uh...making claims against the county for overtime...

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: They took this up with the Department of Labor. The Department of Labor sends a representative down here. He gathers around with it. And not with the fiscal court in an official meeting, but with certain members. And, this has not been brought up at all. Well, this would be a violation of the Sunshine Law in Florida. Because see, I don't have any really good basic knowledge of who said what, see?

Berge: Sure.

Davis: Right now. But, it's just now coming out this Department of Labor didn't even go to the official... uh...Lake Cumberland...uh...

Berge: ADD District?

Davis: EMS system.

Berge: Yeah. Yeah.

Davis: And, the...

Berge: Emergency Medical System.

Davis: ...regional headquarters over at Campbellsville and look up the...the pay records of these fellows to see how much overtime they'd been paid, and how much their claims were.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And, I just can't understand this. They were on the verge of suing the county.

Berge: [Laughing]

Davis: And, uh...

Berge: Well, that's...it's interesting.

Davis: And, and it just seems to me like the state needs to give more guidance to the counties, but...uh...in some particulars it just doesn't seem like they're doing their jobs.

Berge: Virginia, let me ask you some questions. Uh... How do you get, how do you handle the...uh... the Justice strike. Are you getting many gaffs because of things you've put about that?

Davis: Well, I've handled many labor controversies of...uh...various 53:00assortments. And, I've always tried to be fair with them. It's not my fight.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Uh...they have economic issues on both sides. And, when I came...uh...to this...

Berge: In other words, you don't feel you're an investigative reporter, trying to win a Pulitzer Prize, then? You're just going to write what you know.

Davis: Uh, well...here was my...uh...thrust when I came here. I had already seen some past issues of the Record, and...uh...kind of backgrounded myself on the strike. And, I saw that they had already done such a good job that I felt like McCreary County Record had to be an award winner for its coverage of the Justice strike. Ken Shmidheiser had done the leg work. Well, I know from experience, when you've been in from the bottom on any big, running story that 54:00you like to keep...uh...involved and you like the recognition and credit you're going to get for it. So, instead of my taking it over, I said...uh...I told them that I would like for Ken to keep on doing what he was doing. And, if anything happened down here as I progressed and came to know all parties, that I would do whatever I could, but to really consider the Justice strike his baby still, you know. Well, of course, as times gone on I have become involved and...uh...from the very time that the 117 got arrested...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...by the State Police, I was involved. And, uh, I have...uh...had...uh...problems with some of the strikers, but I think they have 55:00come to feel that I have been...uh...just as fair with them as I possibly could be. That I have bent over backwards to...uh...give them ...uh...space. And, uh...Ken has had much closer rapport with the...uh...management side of it because they're in Knoxville, he's already established contacts with them. So, I don't even call them unless it's absolutely necessary. And, I've had really no problems. And, we have...we haven't really missed a thing so far.

Berge: Well, that's good. I...uh...you know, I was just wondering how you were able to handle...

Davis: The excitement's really one thing that interested me in taking this job. I thought, well, gee, that's like Montgomery. That's where it's at.

Berge: Uh-huh. Where does Ken...uh...work out of? This office or...

Davis: No, he's up there. He's...

Berge: Up...up in...uh...

Davis: He's the news editor on the Commonwealth Journal. And, he makes up 56:00the...uh...uh... Record. He does all the desk work up there.

Berge: For this?

Davis: For this.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: He writes the heads and makes up the front page.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And that sort of thing. He..

Berge: How long's he been...

Davis: He's our associate editor.

Berge: How long has he been associate editor for the paper?

Davis: Hmmm.

Berge: Before you came?

Davis: Yes, uh-huh.

Berge: So, what I...

Davis: He's just continued doing what he was already doing.

Berge: Yeah. What I generally do is I try to talk with two editors from each paper. It probably wouldn't be a bad idea to have him be the second editor from this paper to talk with then, wouldn't it?

Davis: That's right.

Berge: It would... Particularly since his relationship with the Justice...uh...block. Have you ever felt that...uh...the... your publishers would...uh...try to restrict you in...in any way? Put any pressure on you to...

Davis: Never.

Berge: You feel really free here, then?

Davis: Well, I've never had a publisher that ever...uh, really...uh...put any 57:00pressure on me. I...I really wouldn't stand for it. Now, of course, there are things that come up from time to time that...uh...you need somebody else's counsel.

Berge: Oh, I'm sure. Sure. Different perspective, too, probably.

Davis: Well, no, but I mean, you may...uh...write a story that you think, well now, is this going to hurt somebody, or is this going to get us in trouble...uh...in a libel...uh...sort of way. And, I think this out, and I say, well...uh... two heads are better than one. What do you think about this? And there have been stories and we have had to counsel with our attorneys...

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: ...about. I just couldn't have a better relationship.

Berge: Good. It's got to be a little early to ask you this because you've only been here a couple...not quite a couple years. But, if...uh...one of the things 58:00that we've been trying to do in this study is to get some idea as to who are the decision makers in each county. Now, like, well, I mean, that's one of the reasons we picked newspaper editors, and school superintendents, and county judges. Really county-judge executives now. We could, you know, we could pick...we could put some other offices on there, and we probably will eventually, but we had to have something to start with. Who would you say are the people who get things done, for better or worse, in this...uh...in this county? Uh...is indi...individuals maybe who aren't public officials or public officials? In other words, if you were wanting to get the court of the people in this county to...uh...say float a bond issue, or something, you know, just some 59:00hypothetical thing. Who are the people you'd have to get behind it?

Davis: Well, hum...that's really a good question. I think, one I may be still seeking the answers to.

Berge: Well, that's what I assumed when I asked the question.

Davis: Uh... McCreary County has a terrific lack of young community leadership. People...

Berge: I think that's endemic to this whole area, really.

Davis: Uh-huh.

Berge: Don't you?

Davis: And this is unfortunate. The people who make things happen...uh...have been...uh...men who are now getting toward retirement age.

Berge: They also are the same ones who keep things from happening.

Davis: Right.

Berge: Uh-huh. OK. Look, so I should have asked that question a little more carefully. Who are the ones who either do things or keep things from being done? Now... Who would they be in this county?

Davis: Well, it's in...it's in every community...uh...the establishment 60:00that...uh...has established...uh...authority, prestige, uh...

Berge: Who would they be, some of them?

Davis: ...money, ...uh...jobs...uh...

Berge: You say something about the schools there. Lot of jobs in the schools.

Davis: Very.

Berge: That...that's really Eastern Kentucky. That's Eastern Kentucky, generally.

Davis: I couldn't really...uh...

Berge: How about the bankers? Are they... How...how many banks in this town or this county?

Davis: Just one.

Berge: All right. Would...would you say traditionally the bankers in this county have been progressive or dragging their feet?

Davis: I can't really see that the banks have had had any real...uh...uh...leadership role...uh...in the community. I mean, 61:00in...in...in...in...you know forcing issues. Or forcing opinion, or anything like that. Now, I have known this in... to happen. I mean, they were the power...

Berge: I have seen some communities where people have told me that the banks literally were really quite...uh...reactionary, at least...uh...reactionary in a sense of not trying to see any kind of modernization until maybe some kind of other agency, like a building and loan association, came in and they were a little more progressive and then the banks sort of stepped up, too. You know, I've seen that happen in some communities. Uh, how about, uh...say, any physicians? There's no hospital in the county, is there?

Davis: That's right.

Berge: There is no hospital. Is that right?

Davis: No. No. We have to go to Oneida or Somerset.

Berge: Is... Do you ever hear people talk...

Davis: We have a good medical center here.

Berge: Oh, you do? You do?

Davis: A brand new one.

Berge: Uh-huh. Do you think there's ever any chance of a hospital? Or any need?

Davis: I don't think there is a need for a hospital.

Berge: Because of the location?

Davis: I don't think so.

Berge: OK. Uh...

Davis: You've got a very expensive...uh...modern hospital in Somerset. Uh... And, I think too many hospitals is...uh...proliferated and...uh...people don't really... We've got a brand new medical center here... [Tape stopped and restarted]

Berge: You were...uh... you were saying about the doctors and...and...or that you have pretty good medical care. Let me just ask you one other...a couple more questions about this. Are there any doctors who appear to be civic...civic leaders?

Davis: Oh, yes.

Berge: Uh...how about...

Davis: Dr. Winchester particularly is.

Berge: Is he young or old?

Davis: Chairman of the park...uh...division.

Berge: Is he young or old?

Davis: I think...he's...about...oh, looks like he might be fiftyish.

Berge: So, he's not old then?

Davis: No. Uh-huh.

Berge: How about any...uh...of course, this isn't really an agriculture...uh...place so you can't really talk about big farmers 'cause there are no big farms in the county.

Davis: Oh, yes, this is about ninety-five percent woodland, I think.

Berge: So, no really large farms or anything like that. How about the...uh...are there any old politicians, like former judges or people like that, who are fairly active still in the community?

Davis: Uh...I think Judge Anderson had...uh...uh...a great power base and did a very good job for the county. I understand he was a very good businessman.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: And...uh...a great deal of progress was made. But, he went out of office before I came here. He resigned for health reasons. And, I have never even seen him.

Berge: Hmm.

Davis: Uh...his predecessor is...uh...deceased. And...uh...his...uh...successor is an interim county judge. Uh...has not had too much...

Berge: Is that the one that's in now, you mean?

Davis: ...input. No. Un-uh.

Berge: Oh. That's the one before.

Davis: Judge Joe Perry.

Berge: Yeah. OK.

Davis: The one that's in now...

Berge: He just got elected, didn't he?

Davis: Just got elected. Uh... I think he has the makings of a good county judge.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: Uh...he still...uh...yet to prove himself.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: But, I think...uh...I feel sure that his interests are...are...are to better McCreary County.

Berge: Well, that's good.

Davis: And...and...and a lot of good things have happened here since I've come 65:00here. We've got a new six million dollar high school. Uh...a new library. Uh...uh...just a lot of things. The district court has come in...uh...

Berge: Do you think that's good?

Davis: I...I really do. It's put a sense of fair play and professionalism and taken a lot of politics out of small, judicial matters. And...and...uh...I think the benefit is just...uh...gonna be something that McCreary countians are going to be realizing in years to come.

Berge: Let me ask you a question about that. Uh, you know, for a while there, it looked to me that the anti-judicial system people were gonna be able to make the, what I consider to be the typical conservative Kentuckian react against it, but I don't think it's going to work. I think it's going to...I don't think they're going to bother the system much. Do you?

Davis: I don't know. There's a movement here.

Berge: I know. There is every...our county...

Davis: Here the squires...

Berge: Our county's really been ...

Davis: ...the squires, see...are...are right now apprehensive about their authority. See...

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: ...with the district court and judicial reform...uh the legislature...uh...comes along and passes new law about the power of the county judge. Well, what they've actually done is set up a system...uh...that permits every county to go in to a professional county manager type government. I mean, you could dispense with an elected county judge...

Berge: That's right.

Davis: ...and hire a county manager and really get something done.

Berge: Somebody who knew how to get federal and state funds.

Davis: That's right. And it'd be worth the money.

Berge: That's right.

Davis: Uh, for instance...uh...

Berge: Cities...

Davis: One...one thing...

Berge: Cities are doing this.

Davis: One thing that...uh...that...the uh...impressed a group of local people 67:00and...uh...people from down in this ...uh...uh... Big South Fork area. They went over to Gatlinburg and Pigeon Forge to find out...uh...how those small communities had dealt with the...uh...Great Smokey Mountain National Park coming in. And, uh...how to avoid their problems. Well, they were impressed that the people they have in office are county managers, city managers, uh...people who are young men who are trained in municipal and county governmental management. Well, this is what we need here.

Berge: Yeah, I think...

Davis: People who know what they're doing.

Berge: I think it's pretty well true of all...most...most of the state. I...uh... I really want to thank you for allowing me to come down here. And, I hope that if I ever...when I get listening to this find out something I forgot, you'll let me come down and ask you a few more questions.

Davis: Yeah.

Berge: Thank you for your time. I know it's a bother for me to come here, but 68:00I've really enjoyed. Thank you very much. [Tape stopped and restarted]

Berge: Virginia, when I...uh...turned it off a minute ago there was another question that I had meant to ask you, and I would like to ask you now. Uh...I may get two or three questions in one. Do you belong to...uh... press associations? And if so, why? And if you don't, why not. And, just how valuable they...you think they might be.

Davis: Well, I belonged to the Florida Women's Press Club when I worked in Florida...uh...and when I was with the Tampa Times. Uh...I was really fascinated with the...uh...thing they did there. They had experts in the field...uh...who came as our guest speakers. And...they...I always came back inspired. Uh...I attended a meeting of the Florida Press Association at Gatlinburg last summer 69:00and...uh...to tell you the truth I was disappointed.

Berge: You mean Florida or Kentucky?

Davis: The Kentucky Press Association.

Berge: Yeah. OK. OK.

Davis: I was disappointed.

Berge: What was the difference?

Davis: Well, uh...it seemed to me...uh...just not a very...uh...

Berge: Professional?

Davis: Go-getting, professional...uh...type thing. I didn't really...

Berge: It...it's sort of....

Davis: ...get much out of it.

Berge: Was it sort of the good old boys getting together kind of stuff?

Davis: Good ole boy type thing. Right.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: They did...

Berge: Why do you think they do that?

Davis: ...pass a resolution about...uh...litterbugging or going into recycling newsprint to avoid becoming a litterbug or something to that effect. But, uh...it didn't seem to really go over too big. And, I...I feel real bad about this. I think that a strong, professional association is...is really necessary. 70:00And...and really the thing that I'm really disappointed in Kentucky is that I come here and I find that...that there's a sales tax. Why this is a violation of your constitutional rights. Uh...in fact, I've got an editorial in the...uh...paper this week about that...uh...Richmond legislator who wants to put up a "United We Stand, Divided We Fall" ...

Berge: On your desk. [Laughing]

Davis: ...on my desk so that I'll...can you imagine me looking at it all day long with that cartoon...

Berge: Yeah.

Davis: ...and all the other...uh...gop I've got around here? That would remain in most editors'...uh...minds about ten seconds.

Berge: Sure.

Davis: But...uh...a sale tax on...on newspapers. Here's what it does. Uh...you 71:00pass a law. Well, the newspaper has to go along with it. We've got a girl out front who spends hours...uh...figuring up what you call deferred payments. See, when everybody sends in their subscription...uh...payments all through twelve months of the year...uh...she's got to figure out how much the state of Kentucky's suppose to get in sales tax out of that.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: Well, you can imagine what we're paying her all that time to do that for.

Berge: Hm-hum. Hm-hum.

Davis: Well, what's it doing? It...it makes me work six days a week and I worked, incidentally, from 8 a.m. yesterday till 10:30 p.m. last night with a peanut butter sandwich for lunch.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: Uh... We don't have the sports writer or the feature writer or...or the...uh the money to spend for putting out more news and more information and 72:00more entertainment for our readers. We have to spend it to send up to Frankfort, see. So who is paying? The people that buy our paper who are being denied that much extra McCreary County Record.

Berge: Hm-huh.

Davis: So they're the ones that are being deprived. Not the newspaper. That's just a business expense, see?

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: The litterbug tax...we don't...we don't have one waste can a week. We could take it across the street and dump it free in the Dempsey Dumpster. But, we pay...uh...the private garbage collection service eight dollars a month to pick up our one garbage can a week.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: This is ridiculous. We're not litterbugs.

Berge: Uh-huh.

Davis: All of the paper that we have in those stored newspapers, that's why I 73:00was working 10:30 last night. I was getting up all the old stored newspapers we no longer need. Our man, Ernest, has a use for 'em. He took them home last week. So, we don't have any waste.

Berge: Hm-hum

Davis: The Commonwealth Journal may have some waste from its press run. I don't know about that. But, we're being taxed along with every other newspaper in the state of Kentucky. A litterbug tax. Well, to me that's a violation. Uh... Congress...and...our ...any state legislature shall not...uh...abridge the freedom of the pre...press by making any law.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: But, they've done it in Kentucky. Now, when we sell a subscription we assume that sales tax in our subscription rate.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: The...the company pays it for Kentucky subscribers.

Berge: Hm-hum.

Davis: But, the other people in any other state in the union, they don't have to pay the sale tax for subscribing to this newspaper. And, I just think that it's a...a violation of all the Kentucky subscribers' rights.

Berge: What's your...uh...

Davis: It's asinine, and I'm surprised that the people allow their legislators to put these taxes on. I'm disappointed and surprised that the Kentucky Press Association...

Berge: Didn't fight.

Davis: ... didn't have more lobbying...uh...capacity and strength to...to defeat that legislation.

Berge: One other question. What's your circulation?

Davis: Uh...up as high as five thousand. Somewhere between...uh...uh...forty- five hundred and five thousand.

Berge: What's the population of this county?

Davis: About fourteen thousand.

Berge: Well, that's pretty good then, isn't it?

Davis: Most of it illiterate.

Berge: Yeah. But, that...but, that's good circulation. That is.

Davis: Yes, it is. Oh, people love the Record.

Berge: Yeah. Yeah.

Davis: In fact, uh...they just stand in line, I think, to get it along with their Social Security checks.

Berge: Yes. Well, I want to thank you again Virginia. It's really been a pleasure. And, I'll...I'll see you again sometime. [Tape ends at 1:15:24] [Note: Virginia Wood Davis's papers are at Western Kentucky University and available online at